5 episodes
Aired between 10th August 1968 and 7th September 1968
Written by Norman Ashby
Produced by Peter Bryant
Directed by Morris Barry
Synopsis
A lone spacecraft heads to the planet Dulkis after separating from its fleet.
It lands on an island full of radioactive fallout from an atomic war that took place over a century ago, and sucks up all the radioactive particles. When this is done, two men dressed in strange "armour" emerge from the craft. They are Toba and Rago: members of the Dominators.
By all accounts, Toba is very aggressive and is clearly eager to destroy any natives around the place, but Rago wants to enslave them instead, to help drill into the ground to draw out an energy supply. They agree that the first step is to send their servants: the Quarks off to scout the area.
Elsewhere on the island, a Dulcian explorer pod arrives, piloted by Cully, son of the Dulcian's leader. He has brought some of the younger Dulicans out to the island to show them the remains of the radioactive waste, all from the safety of the pod, of course. However, the pod strangely displays no sign of radioactivity anywhere around them. The customers on this tour begin to think they've been conned and as they squabble, Cully accidentally crashes the pod. The customers soon get fed up and leave the ship, despite Cully's protests that they will die. Oddly enough, they don't, which causes Cully to end up following shortly afterwards.
It's not long before Cully's customers see the Dominators and the Quarks. They call for help and are all killed by the Quarks on Toba's orders.
Cully see's the whole thing as he gets to the top of the dune.
Meanwhile, the TARDIS lands on the Dulcian island. The Doctor immediately identifies where they are and is happy about it, saying how the Dulcians are all wonderful pacifists. He thinks it's the perfect spot for a holiday and gets out a deck chair and beach ball.
Cully races back to the pod, but takes cover as the Quarks approach and destroy the vessel on the orders of Toba. Rago turns up and is furious with Toba for wasting the Quarks energy on primitives. He orders Toba back to the ship.
The TARDIS crew hear the explosion of the pod and decide to investigate. On their way, they come across a demolished building and soon determine that its not the source of the explosion because its been like that for many years. In fact, it turns out to be an old military museum, complete with working examples of past weapons of destruction. As they explore, they encounter three people in radiation suits.
It turns out that the people in the suits are Dulican students looking to study the radiation on the island. They shove the Doctor, Jamie and Zoe in a decontamination chamber in their research station, but surprisingly find them absent of any radiation. They are allowed out and are met by Educator Ballan, and his students Kando and Teel. Through these, the Doctor learns that the Dulcians have never met anyone from outside their planet, but are happy to assume that the TARDIS crew are until proven otherwise.
They also confirm they are pacifists, having nearly destroyed themselves in an atomic war 172 years ago. Once the war was over, all weapons were banned, and the island has been studied ever since by students. They don't however know why there is no radiation now. They assume that radioactive half life of the bomb lasts exactly 172 years.
They also confirm they are pacifists, having nearly destroyed themselves in an atomic war 172 years ago. Once the war was over, all weapons were banned, and the island has been studied ever since by students. They don't however know why there is no radiation now. They assume that radioactive half life of the bomb lasts exactly 172 years.
Elsewhere, Cully finds the TARDIS, and hides behind it, observing the Dominators instructing the Quarks to begin drilling into the ground. Toba spots the TARDIS and suggests destroying it, but Rago again chastises his fellow Dominator for being so aggressive to objects and people who couldn't possibly harm them. He's more bothered about conserving the Quarks battery power.
Cully slips away and moves into the ruined museum where he comes face to face with Teel. he orders the student to take him back to the research station and they leave. Shortly thereafter, Rago and Toba enter the museum and determine that the Dulcians must be warriors based on the weapons, and will no doubt have more sophisticated ones by now.
Cully turns up at the research station with Teel and explains to everyone what's happened. Ballan (like everyone on Dulkis) knows Cully as the son of a powerful director, but also know that he's like the boy who cried wolf and a bit of a practical joker and dissident.
As soon as he see's Cully is involved, Ballan assumes it's all a joke and the Doctor, Jamie and Zoe are part of it. The Doctor however is very concerned at Cully's report and takes Jamie to investigate. Zoe decides to stay at the centre.
As soon as he see's Cully is involved, Ballan assumes it's all a joke and the Doctor, Jamie and Zoe are part of it. The Doctor however is very concerned at Cully's report and takes Jamie to investigate. Zoe decides to stay at the centre.
The Doctor and Jamie make it to the TARDIS and find that it's safe. They notice strange marks on the ground and footprints leading away. The Doctor and Jamie follow and are soon spotted by the Dominators. The Quarks take them prisoner and take them to the Dominators spaceship where they are magnetised to the wall. The Dominators subject Jamie to a physical examination and determine they are inferior life forms.
Toba wants to disintegrate them, but Rago decides to test them instead to see if they're suitable enough for slave labour.
Back at the research centre, Ballan tries to contact the main city on Dulkis, but he's having trouble with the signal, so he sends Zoe and Cully back there in a travel capsule instead. Once at the city, Cully storms into one of the council meetings and tries to tell them all about the Dominators, but just like Ballan, everyone refuses to believe him. Cully's father: Director Senex turns up and has a quiet word with Zoe and Cully, explaining that he's always been aware of his son's trips to the island. However, he also believes that Cully is crying wolf again, and asks Zoe if she can corroborate his story. Unfortunately, she hasn't seen any of the Dominators or Quarks so cannot.
Over at the Dominators ship, the Doctor and Jamie are subjected to a couple of experiments set up to test intelligence. The Doctor quickly figures out that the Dominators are trying to determine if they are a threat and so, he instructs Jamie to act stupid. They both fail the intelligence tests.
Rago is suspicious of them, stating that people of such low intelligence could not make the weapons they have found in the museum. Rago takes them to the said museum and orders the Doctor and Jamie to demonstrate the use of the weapon.
The pair still act dumb, and Jamie nearly fires it at the Doctor's head. Rago threatens them with death, and the Doctor explains that there are two factions of people on Dulkis, his stupid kind, and a more intelligent species that live elsewhere. Toba wants to kill them as they're of no use, but once again, Rago explains it's a waste of power, and orders the Doctor and Jamie to keep out of the Dominators way.
The villains leave the museum, allowing the Doctor and Jamie to creep back to the research centre.
Because no one believes them, Cully and Zoe decide to head back to the island to gather proof (after a quick change of clothes of course). They board a transport capsule and set off.
The Doctor and Jamie get back to the research centre and decide to go to the city after Cully and Zoe, after warning Ballan about the Dominators of course. Ballan doesn't believe them, but his students are a bit worried, so he agrees to take them out into the island wilderness to prove they're wrong. Soon enough, Toba and Rago spot Ballan and the students. Toba predictably wants to destroy them, but Rago thinks they might be the intelligent ones the Doctor talked about, so decides to capture them.
Outside, Ballan and the students do indeed discover the Dominators spaceship and are dumbstruck.
Soon enough they search the ship and are captured by Quarks. They are subjected to the same examination that Rago did on Jamie, and he identifies larger brain power and two hearts, suggesting they are the intelligent race. The Dominatiors go out to find more, and come across the research centre just as Cully and Zoe arrive there in the travel capsule.
Toba decides not to investigate the building and orders the Quarks to destroy it, nearly burying Zoe and Cully inside.
Once again, Rago stops the order before it can be fully completed and has cross words with Toba for wasting the Quarks power. Zoe and Cully emerge from the building coughing and spluttering, and are captured.
Over at the city, the Dulcians are debating what is to be done about Cully's wild stories when the Doctor and Jamie turn up.
They too try to warn the Dulcians of the Dominators hostile intent, but the pacifists state that even if the Dominators do exist, there's no reason to believe that they're hostile. If they want to drill into the planet, so what?
Back at the Dominators ship, Cully and Zoe are forced to join the others. Rago orders them to clear the rubble around the war museum. They are to be worked until they collapse.
The Doctor and Jamie meanwhile decide that they're getting nowhere fast, and so take a travel capsule back to the island. It's only when airborne that Jamie points out the Quarks could have reached the research centre and they'll be captured or killed on arrival. The Doctor agrees and begins pulling wires out of the control board to redirect the capsules path.
They crash land elsewhere on the island, and begin to head out to search for Zoe and the Dulcians.
At the war museum, Zoe and Cully try to convince Ballan and the students to take up arms against the Quarks, but are met with defeatism. Zoe distracts the Quarks anyway, whilst Cully sneaks off into the museum to grab the gun.
The Doctor and Jamie find them all in the labour camp and begin sneaking around to help free them.
Cully grabs the gun and aims it at one of the Quarks but is interrupted by Jamie.
Toba finds the Doctor skulking about and has his suspicions raised, especially when he discovers that Cully's disappeared. One of the Quarks takes a shot from the gun, and Toba orders the remaining ones to blow up the museum, once again threatening to bury Cully alive, and Jamie along with him. Luckily for them, they find an old hatch leading to a fallout shelter underground.
With the building destroyed, Toba is looking very pleased with himself until once again, Rago comes to tell him off. Toba protests and they have a heated argument, but Rago pulls rank and forces Toba to obey.
Jamie and Cully quickly realise that although they are safe in the shelter, the air vent is blocked and it's likely they'll suffocate. They begin trying to force the hatch open again, shifting the rubble on top of it.
Rago once again questions the Doctor and forces him to reveal the location of the Dulcian city. Rago goes off to confront them, leaving Toba to guard the others.
Finally free of the rubble, Jamie and Cully go off on a guerrilla warfare campaign, rolling rocks down hills onto the Quarks.
Presented with the threat, Toba can't contain himself and he goes off with the Quarks to find the culprits.
Left alone, the Doctor and Zoe confirm that the ship is responsible for sucking up all the radiation on the island, and storing it inside the ship.
Rago arrives at the city, and begins ordering the council about, resorting to killing one of them to prove his dominance. He orders that the Council are to start selecting people worthy of slave labour, who will be taken back to the Dominators home planet. There, they will replace Quarks, allowing the machines to be used on the front lines of the Dominators battles. The Dulcians who are too old or sick to be of any use will be left to die on Dulkis.
Toba is fed up of the sabotage and returns to interrogate the Doctor. He kills Ballan when the Doctor refuses to answer and threatens him with his life next. Rago returns and is furious that Toba has ordered the Quarks to stop drilling. They have only drilled four perimeter holes, and haven't even started on the central bore hole. Rago mentions that they also still need a "seed" device preparing, which is approaching critical mass. Toba and Rago have another blazing argument, but Rago is the victor. He orders the Doctor, Zoe, and the students to the drilling site where they are to work.
Once outside, Jamie and Cully take out the Quark guarding the prisoners, and quickly lead them to the fallout shelter before Toba can find them. Toba is again, predictably intent on finding the culprits, and once again, Rago orders him back to drilling. This time however, Rago is obviously fed up of the shenanigans because he says that the Dulcians are unfit as slaves and he's decided to let them all die with the planet.
Inside the shelter, the Doctor pieces together all that he's seen and figures out the Dominators plans. He explains that they intend to drop an atomic bomb down a central bore hole into the planet. Then, they will launch four rockets from the perimeter holes and blow their way through the planets thin crust. This will cause the molten core to erupt in a massive volcano. Once the atomic bomb detonates, it will mean a huge radioactive volcano will consume the surface of Dulkis, which can then be sucked up by the Dominators as a vast power supply for their invasion fleet. Dulkis is therefore just like a petrol station to them.
Thanks to a handy periscope inside the shelter, the group discover that the Dominators are close to completing the central bore hole.
They try to figure out a course of action, but Jamie comes up with the solution - dig a hole through the shelter wall and intersect with the central hole. Then, when the Dominators drop the atomic "seed" down the hole, the group can catch it. The problem is, they need more time if they're going to catch up with the Dominators drilling efforts. The Doctor prepares some explosives from chemicals found in a first aid kit, and Cully and Jamie head out once again to go Quark hunting. This time however, Toba stays on task and orders the Quarks to continue drilling.
Rago takes the only remaining Quarks and finds Jamie and Cully.
They open fire, wounding Cully in the arm, forcing them to retreat back to the fallout shelter. Lucky for them, Zoe and the Students have nearly completed their tunnel.
The Dominators finish the bore hole and drop the seed down.
The Doctor just manages to catch it, and only then realises that it's still live. He looks to see if he can diffuse it, but it's completely sealed.
Toba and Rago order the remaining Quarks back to the ship and prepare to rejoin their fleet in orbit.
With very little time to spare, the Doctor orders Jamie and Zoe back to the TARDIS, and Cully and the students back to the Dulcian city as the island is about to be covered by a localised volcanic eruption. He then races across the wasteland towards the Dominator spaceship, placing the "seed" inside just as the doors close.
The Dominators lift off and Rago gives the order to launch the rockets and detonate the "seed", just as he sees it roll towards his feet.
He panics and yells at Toba to cancel the detonation but it's too late, the Dominator ship explodes into a million tiny sparks of light, harmlessly in the sky.
The Doctor reaches the TARDIS and stops to admire his handywork. He looks quite pleased with himself until Jamie reminds him that they're directly in the path of flowing molten lava.
Trivia
Toba wants to disintegrate them, but Rago decides to test them instead to see if they're suitable enough for slave labour.
Back at the research centre, Ballan tries to contact the main city on Dulkis, but he's having trouble with the signal, so he sends Zoe and Cully back there in a travel capsule instead. Once at the city, Cully storms into one of the council meetings and tries to tell them all about the Dominators, but just like Ballan, everyone refuses to believe him. Cully's father: Director Senex turns up and has a quiet word with Zoe and Cully, explaining that he's always been aware of his son's trips to the island. However, he also believes that Cully is crying wolf again, and asks Zoe if she can corroborate his story. Unfortunately, she hasn't seen any of the Dominators or Quarks so cannot.
Over at the Dominators ship, the Doctor and Jamie are subjected to a couple of experiments set up to test intelligence. The Doctor quickly figures out that the Dominators are trying to determine if they are a threat and so, he instructs Jamie to act stupid. They both fail the intelligence tests.
Rago is suspicious of them, stating that people of such low intelligence could not make the weapons they have found in the museum. Rago takes them to the said museum and orders the Doctor and Jamie to demonstrate the use of the weapon.
The pair still act dumb, and Jamie nearly fires it at the Doctor's head. Rago threatens them with death, and the Doctor explains that there are two factions of people on Dulkis, his stupid kind, and a more intelligent species that live elsewhere. Toba wants to kill them as they're of no use, but once again, Rago explains it's a waste of power, and orders the Doctor and Jamie to keep out of the Dominators way.
The villains leave the museum, allowing the Doctor and Jamie to creep back to the research centre.
Because no one believes them, Cully and Zoe decide to head back to the island to gather proof (after a quick change of clothes of course). They board a transport capsule and set off.
The Doctor and Jamie get back to the research centre and decide to go to the city after Cully and Zoe, after warning Ballan about the Dominators of course. Ballan doesn't believe them, but his students are a bit worried, so he agrees to take them out into the island wilderness to prove they're wrong. Soon enough, Toba and Rago spot Ballan and the students. Toba predictably wants to destroy them, but Rago thinks they might be the intelligent ones the Doctor talked about, so decides to capture them.
Outside, Ballan and the students do indeed discover the Dominators spaceship and are dumbstruck.
Soon enough they search the ship and are captured by Quarks. They are subjected to the same examination that Rago did on Jamie, and he identifies larger brain power and two hearts, suggesting they are the intelligent race. The Dominatiors go out to find more, and come across the research centre just as Cully and Zoe arrive there in the travel capsule.
Toba decides not to investigate the building and orders the Quarks to destroy it, nearly burying Zoe and Cully inside.
Once again, Rago stops the order before it can be fully completed and has cross words with Toba for wasting the Quarks power. Zoe and Cully emerge from the building coughing and spluttering, and are captured.
Over at the city, the Dulcians are debating what is to be done about Cully's wild stories when the Doctor and Jamie turn up.
They too try to warn the Dulcians of the Dominators hostile intent, but the pacifists state that even if the Dominators do exist, there's no reason to believe that they're hostile. If they want to drill into the planet, so what?
Back at the Dominators ship, Cully and Zoe are forced to join the others. Rago orders them to clear the rubble around the war museum. They are to be worked until they collapse.
The Doctor and Jamie meanwhile decide that they're getting nowhere fast, and so take a travel capsule back to the island. It's only when airborne that Jamie points out the Quarks could have reached the research centre and they'll be captured or killed on arrival. The Doctor agrees and begins pulling wires out of the control board to redirect the capsules path.
They crash land elsewhere on the island, and begin to head out to search for Zoe and the Dulcians.
At the war museum, Zoe and Cully try to convince Ballan and the students to take up arms against the Quarks, but are met with defeatism. Zoe distracts the Quarks anyway, whilst Cully sneaks off into the museum to grab the gun.
The Doctor and Jamie find them all in the labour camp and begin sneaking around to help free them.
Cully grabs the gun and aims it at one of the Quarks but is interrupted by Jamie.
Toba finds the Doctor skulking about and has his suspicions raised, especially when he discovers that Cully's disappeared. One of the Quarks takes a shot from the gun, and Toba orders the remaining ones to blow up the museum, once again threatening to bury Cully alive, and Jamie along with him. Luckily for them, they find an old hatch leading to a fallout shelter underground.
With the building destroyed, Toba is looking very pleased with himself until once again, Rago comes to tell him off. Toba protests and they have a heated argument, but Rago pulls rank and forces Toba to obey.
Jamie and Cully quickly realise that although they are safe in the shelter, the air vent is blocked and it's likely they'll suffocate. They begin trying to force the hatch open again, shifting the rubble on top of it.
Rago once again questions the Doctor and forces him to reveal the location of the Dulcian city. Rago goes off to confront them, leaving Toba to guard the others.
Finally free of the rubble, Jamie and Cully go off on a guerrilla warfare campaign, rolling rocks down hills onto the Quarks.
Presented with the threat, Toba can't contain himself and he goes off with the Quarks to find the culprits.
Left alone, the Doctor and Zoe confirm that the ship is responsible for sucking up all the radiation on the island, and storing it inside the ship.
Rago arrives at the city, and begins ordering the council about, resorting to killing one of them to prove his dominance. He orders that the Council are to start selecting people worthy of slave labour, who will be taken back to the Dominators home planet. There, they will replace Quarks, allowing the machines to be used on the front lines of the Dominators battles. The Dulcians who are too old or sick to be of any use will be left to die on Dulkis.
Toba is fed up of the sabotage and returns to interrogate the Doctor. He kills Ballan when the Doctor refuses to answer and threatens him with his life next. Rago returns and is furious that Toba has ordered the Quarks to stop drilling. They have only drilled four perimeter holes, and haven't even started on the central bore hole. Rago mentions that they also still need a "seed" device preparing, which is approaching critical mass. Toba and Rago have another blazing argument, but Rago is the victor. He orders the Doctor, Zoe, and the students to the drilling site where they are to work.
Once outside, Jamie and Cully take out the Quark guarding the prisoners, and quickly lead them to the fallout shelter before Toba can find them. Toba is again, predictably intent on finding the culprits, and once again, Rago orders him back to drilling. This time however, Rago is obviously fed up of the shenanigans because he says that the Dulcians are unfit as slaves and he's decided to let them all die with the planet.
Inside the shelter, the Doctor pieces together all that he's seen and figures out the Dominators plans. He explains that they intend to drop an atomic bomb down a central bore hole into the planet. Then, they will launch four rockets from the perimeter holes and blow their way through the planets thin crust. This will cause the molten core to erupt in a massive volcano. Once the atomic bomb detonates, it will mean a huge radioactive volcano will consume the surface of Dulkis, which can then be sucked up by the Dominators as a vast power supply for their invasion fleet. Dulkis is therefore just like a petrol station to them.
Thanks to a handy periscope inside the shelter, the group discover that the Dominators are close to completing the central bore hole.
They try to figure out a course of action, but Jamie comes up with the solution - dig a hole through the shelter wall and intersect with the central hole. Then, when the Dominators drop the atomic "seed" down the hole, the group can catch it. The problem is, they need more time if they're going to catch up with the Dominators drilling efforts. The Doctor prepares some explosives from chemicals found in a first aid kit, and Cully and Jamie head out once again to go Quark hunting. This time however, Toba stays on task and orders the Quarks to continue drilling.
Rago takes the only remaining Quarks and finds Jamie and Cully.
They open fire, wounding Cully in the arm, forcing them to retreat back to the fallout shelter. Lucky for them, Zoe and the Students have nearly completed their tunnel.
The Dominators finish the bore hole and drop the seed down.
The Doctor just manages to catch it, and only then realises that it's still live. He looks to see if he can diffuse it, but it's completely sealed.
Toba and Rago order the remaining Quarks back to the ship and prepare to rejoin their fleet in orbit.
With very little time to spare, the Doctor orders Jamie and Zoe back to the TARDIS, and Cully and the students back to the Dulcian city as the island is about to be covered by a localised volcanic eruption. He then races across the wasteland towards the Dominator spaceship, placing the "seed" inside just as the doors close.
The Dominators lift off and Rago gives the order to launch the rockets and detonate the "seed", just as he sees it roll towards his feet.
He panics and yells at Toba to cancel the detonation but it's too late, the Dominator ship explodes into a million tiny sparks of light, harmlessly in the sky.
The Doctor reaches the TARDIS and stops to admire his handywork. He looks quite pleased with himself until Jamie reminds him that they're directly in the path of flowing molten lava.
- Wendy Padbury didn't get on well with Morris Barry at all. It seems he liked to treat her like the new kid on the block who knew nothing and had to pay her dues
- There was a lot of controversy surrounding the writing of this episode. The real authors were Mervyn Haisman and Henry Lincoln of Yeti fame. They wrote it originally as a six parter, but script editor Derrick Sherwin was unhappy with it and decided that the action was spread too thin, so dropped it down to five episodes. Haisman and Lincoln argued that the stuff he cut was all the philosophical political content put there to make people think about their stand on current events such as Vietnam. As a result, they took their name off the credits and used an amalgamated name of their father-in-laws.
- Another problem for the writers was that they were asked to come up with a monster to supercede the Daleks and Cybermen as the next big thing. What they came up with was the Quarks. Allegedly, the reality of the robot design didn't come close to writers vision and they were unhappy with it all, especially as they'd struck a deal with toy manufacturers who were waiting for a green light.
- Haisman and Lincoln undertook a big no no by waiting until the show was in the can before threatening the BBC with an injunction on the show, forbidding it to go out unless a compromise could be reached regarding the rights to the monster etc. The upshot was they were paid off and told by Derrick Sherwin that they'd never work in the BBC again. Hence no more Yeti.
What worked
- It's refreshing to see some dissent amongst the aliens. It gives at least a little depth to the characters
- Rago really comes across as menacing when he wants to be
- As with stories such as the Faceless Ones, the interplay between Jamie and the Doctor is on top form here, and a pleasure to see
- We've had so many alien invasion stories over Patrick Troughtons run that it's a breath of fresh air to see that actually, they want something different this time
What didn't work
- If the Duclians don't believe in other races from the stars, how does the Doctor know Dulkis?
- All this "Quarks...Destroy!" business really does get boring after a bit
- So, when told of the threat they face, the Dulcians believe that the Dominators could be friendly...the Dominators.....surely the name gives it away
- Brian Cant in a smock
- Did some of that stupidity wear off on the Doctor? Why doesn't he realise that they could be captured if they go back to the research centre?
- The Quarks voice. I can't tell a blinking thing that they say!
Overall Feelings
This is a tough one. For a lot of people, the Dominators is a story that you just love to hate. It promised much but delivered little. You only have to read the words "replacements for the Daleks" and then take a look at the Quarks to see why.
In a lot of places, the writers try to do something different and then go overboard or go to extremes. Toba is an embodiment of what you think a "Dominator" should be, but is virtually incapable of taking a hint to restrain himself from the violence. Rago is a fantastic juxtaposition, but by episode three, you begin to wonder why he hasn't strangled Toba to death. Another example is the subtext the writers put in. They allegedly wanted the show to be a statement on what can happen if everyone listened to all these peace loving hippies and became pacifists, or at least flipped the script on governments that wanted to start wars all the time. However, even the most pacifistic society would be cautious of a race called the Dominators.
I personally think there's enough original ideas in here to be entertained, but Derrick Sherwin was right. Between the scenes that make you think, airtime is filled up by running back and forth in a quarry with robots who look like they're trying to keep themselves from being cold (watch it and you'll see what I mean). In addition, for the plot to work a lot of the characters have to act dumb, least of which are the Dominators, and the Dulcians. The Doctor is even at it, forgetting to consider pretty essential things like heading straight towards the most likely place to be hit, erm, forgetting to consider disarming the atomic bomb and of course standing and smiling whilst lava is heading straight towards you. The end result is ok, but I find myself thinking that out of all the episodes to still be missing, I would not lament if this was one.
Rating
7 out of 10
Rewatchability Factor
4 out of 10
Watch this if you liked...
Consulting the Matrix
Who was right, Rago or Toba?
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